10.45 am

I welcome the discussion on road safety planned for the April meeting. Stark signage on the roads, detailing the number of injuries and deaths that have occurred at accident black spots, also needs to be considered in places such as County Louth.

The Member has gone into substantial detail on particular problems, but the institutional format sector deals with issues at a higher level. Perhaps the Deputy First Minister can respond on that higher level.

The issues are at a higher level, but they are less interesting at times than those which Mr McElduff raised. The First Minister referred to interparliamentary arrangements between the Assembly and the Oireachtas as foreshadowed in the agreement, whereas Mr McElduff referred to matters on a different footing.

A meeting of the health sector of the North/South Ministerial Council will deal with health issues, and the matters raised by Mr McElduff are appropriate to that sector. Any institutional matters that arise with regard to limitations of the arrangements constituted would be relayed through a plenary session of the North/South Ministerial Council and, if need be, picked up at the institutional format meeting. It would not, however, have been appropriate for us to deal with the Member’s points at that meeting.

We will not take specific initiatives on road safety in the institutional format, but our discussions will recognise that one area of co-operation in which little progress has been made is transport. Therefore, the important area of road safety will be ripe for early activity.

I congratulate the First Minister and the Deputy First Minister on the work outlined in the statement and the report, which I read in the Library. It is encouraging for cross-border co-operation.

However, will consideration be given to more direct contact between the different working groups and the departmental Committees on areas of similar work and research, for example, on EU issues? The Committee of the Centre has already started to consider those matters.

This was an initial meeting in institutional format, and provision for discussion of EU matters is foreshadowed in a paragraph in the agreement that clearly relates to those issues. The Council has not yet been able to make significant progress on EU matters. We will ask officials to consider how the Council can be used and how its views can be reflected more fully in the European context. The EU is based on a treaty and defines its own mode of operation. Our Administration participates in EU matters through the UK representation in Europe and the UK delegation in the Council of Ministers. The Irish Government also participate directly in the Council of Ministers. A memorandum of understanding between the devolved Administration and the UK Government details how devolved issues will be taken into account at meetings of the Council of Ministers.

With regard to the North/South Ministerial Council, what is being discussed is the way in which we can exchange information and alert each other to sensitivities and priorities that may arise in order to inform the way in which the formal arrangements within the Council of Ministers operate. We are exploring the opportunities for that, and if we develop procedures for the exchange of information, we will want to ensure that there is appropriate consultation through the Assembly Committees or other appropriate channels.

One advantage of the North/South procedure is that, through reports to the Assembly, it is as transparent as we can make it. The Assembly’s confidence in the transparency of the arrangements is reflected by the way in which so many Members are content to leave the operation of the arrangements to us.

The First Minister will be aware — and the Deputy First Minister will be more than aware — of the difficulties that exist in marrying together strategic North/South transport issues. Is there an element of safety in concentrating on road safety issues, given the particular ministerial responsibility in this Administration? The marrying together of transport issues should be brought forward via the Department for Regional Development. How do the considerations of the North/ South Ministerial Council meeting connect with those at British- Irish Council level, where we are taking the lead on transport matters?

Road safety merits significant attention from the Administrations in both jurisdictions. The respective Departments have co-operated and have made efforts to raise awareness of the issue through advertising. We must work to make that more effective. The issue is being progressed on its own terms and merits.

We share the concern that more work has not been done at North/South level on transport, which is a designated area of co-operation, not least on strategic matters. Nevertheless, it has not prevented us from creating a situation where the Executive have been able to commit resources to the improvement of the Larne to Dundalk route. That will complement improvements on the Dublin to Dundalk road on the Southern side. The issues must be examined, given that they involve significant areas of infrastructure investment, which is significant and challenging for both Administrations.

The aftermath of 11 September has transport implications, especially for air links. It will affect not only our tourist industry but also business and market access. That does not concern only the North and the South; it affects other Administrations within the British- Irish Council. Transport, for which this Administration was given the lead in the British-Irish Council, touches on many issues at many levels. We are working to ensure that we make the most of our responsibilities and of the opportunities that exist through the North/South Ministerial Council and the British-Irish Council.

The final paragraph of the First Minister’s statement states: 

"A paper setting out the existing areas of co-operation between the two Administrations that do not fall within the current North/ South Ministerial Council work programme was noted and discussed in broad terms".

Which areas were discussed?

I am glad that the Member raised that question, for two reasons. First, it may be that the DUP, since the failure of its legal challenge, now recognises the First Minister and the Deputy First Minister by asking them questions. The House is glad to note that development.

Secondly, comments by DUP spokespersons after the institutional format meeting revealed that they did not understand the position with regard to co-operation in the North/South Ministerial Council. I will explain that position for those DUP Members who fail singularly to understand it. Co-operation with the Council happens in two different categories: those matters that are jointly administered — the areas of the six implementation bodies — and the matters on which there is interdepartmental co-operation. When the Council was formed, six areas of interdepartmental co-operation were identified.

Much interdepartmental co-operation falls outside the ambit of the North/South Ministerial Council. Those numerous areas of co-operation were developed before, and during, direct rule. The Office of the First Minister and Deputy First Minister obtained a report of some 30 pages which lists the areas of interdepartmental co-operation. Officials have been asked to examine that report, to offer advice and to consider further whether it would be appropriate to bring those areas of co-operation within the ambit of the Council. That would result in considerable advantages, which the DUP would welcome: at present, those areas of interdepartmental co-operation that are outside the Council’s ambit are not subject to transparency or reportage and are not brought before the Assembly. If they are brought within the ambit of the Council, there will be accountability.

Among the areas that are outside the ambit of the North/South Ministerial Council is energy, including the recent announcements regarding electricity and North/ South gas interconnections. Environmental co-operation includes the disposal of clinical waste through facilities in Dublin, Cork and Antrim. An industrial pollution and radiochemical inspectorate has been working jointly with relevant bodies in the South on emergency planning and environmental monitoring issues.

In higher education there is collaboration within the university and research sector through the funding of joint projects. In the area of health and social services there has been co-operation in nursing, dentistry and human resources, involving the exchange of information and the secondment of a senior social services official to assist in the establishment of an inspectorate in the South. On social and community issues there has been co-ordination of social security provisions, involving official-level co-operation through a liaison group that brings together the Department of Social, Community and Family Affairs in the Republic of Ireland and the Department for Social Development in Northern Ireland. It might be appropriate to bring such co-operation under the ambit of the North/South Ministerial Council to ensure accountability. I am sure that the DUP would not wish to escape accountability on that aspect of the Department for Social Development’s responsibility.

I had intended to ask whether issues such as energy and higher education were being considered for further co-operation. However, the First Minister has already answered my question in his statement.

When the original areas of co-operation between North and South were established, it was decided that any new areas would have to be agreed by the Assembly and the Oireachtas. Any adjustments or additions to those areas of co-operation must be done properly under the auspices of an institutional format. Any outcome or decision would then be brought before the Chamber and the Oireachtas respectively.