Northern Ireland Assembly
Monday 12 June 2000 (continued)
4.30 pm
Mr Bradley:
I was hoping that this debate would go on until lunchtime tomorrow so that I could have read from Hansard and said everything that should have been said.
Every Member has recognised the Minister's position and what he has inherited. However, I have taken figures from the publication. If we look at the provisions sought by the various Departments we find that percentage adjustments read as follows: Department of Culture, Arts and Leisure, 0·7% higher; Department for Social Development, 2% higher; Department of the Environment, 2·4% higher, Department of Health and Social Services, 7·7% higher; Department of Education, 8·7% higher; Department for Regional Development, 10·9% higher; Department of Higher and Further Education, 12% higher; and the Office of the First Minister and the Deputy First Minister, 6·3% higher.
However, it is possibly because I come from the Agriculture and Rural Development Committee background that I notice those figures. I have every right to be concerned about the 38·4% reduction in the provisions sought for the Department of Agriculture and Rural Development. The Minister will understand my concern because I note that his Department also has a minus figure of almost 6%, but that is certainly a lot less than the 38·4% reduction for agriculture.
I cannot resist asking whether the 38·4% reduction is a reflection of the British Government's attitude to the agriculture economy in general. I believe that that is our feeling. We fought through the years, and we saw the farmers' situation. We continually realised their difficulties. We knew what the British Government was doing. However, when you see the figures of the planned reductions in front of you, the Assembly could not get up and going soon enough. As has been mentioned earlier, that is the beauty of having our own Ministers.
Does the Minister agree that the failure of the British Government to draw down all agri-monetary compensation funding from Europe acts as a deterrent to the financial viability of the agriculture industry here? Will the continuance of such a policy affect his plans for the future and will it make life more difficult for him if the British Government continue to fail to draw down that money for us?
Can the Minister assure the Assembly that his future budgets will reflect the importance of agriculture in industry and in the overall economy of Northern Ireland.
Ms Gildernew:
Go raibh maith agat. I too welcome the publication of these Estimates and the tabling of the motion. However, I have a number of concerns about the funding for the Department for Social Development. Economic empowerment is crucial to the process of urban regeneration and to the social and physical well-being of our communities. The elimination of poverty and the stigma of dependency must be a key priority of the Assembly, and in order to create a better future for all our citizens we need to fund areas to tackle poverty properly.
We have the right to expect the state to provide good quality housing. I am concerned, therefore, that the Housing Executive's budget was recently slashed by £13·7 million, meaning that essential maintenance to Housing Executive properties will have to be cancelled this year. If we are to bring down housing waiting lists, reduce the number of people waiting for disabled adaptations, and reduce levels of unfitness - particularly in rural counties such as Fermanagh and Tyrone - the Housing Executive must be properly resourced. There is still a long way to go in terms of the high levels of dereliction and unfitness in many parts of the Six Counties.
If we have the resources needed to provide quality homes for all then we can effectively tackle the problems faced by other Departments, particularly the Department of Health, Social Services and Public Safety. Need, and not financial restraints, should determine new build programmes, and we must be innovative in dealing with issues such as homelessness and long waiting lists, particularly in areas of Belfast and Derry.
Another area of concern is the community and voluntary sector, which is currently under severe pressure due to the gap in European funding. Given that this sector is one of the largest employers in the Six Counties and has done exemplary work in terms of community development, it is disgraceful that we have not legislated for this gap. The implications of many community organisations having to close their doors, possibly permanently, are impossible to imagine. Government Departments have not considered the absence of the cross-border and cross-community aspects of community development and how their demise will be dealt with.
We need to be thinking of special initiatives for deprived areas and ways of eliminating social exclusion, not creating additional pressures on this sector. There is a dire need for funding for both rural and urban parts of the Six Counties and the border counties in order to create social, economic and physical regeneration.
We must share the wealth to create parity and avoid concentrating resources in one or two parts of the North. Initiatives like Laganside have done much to enhance that part of Belfast but at what expense to the rest of Belfast or the other counties?
I am greatly concerned too that there may be a channelling of European money towards subsidising businesses, not because I disagree with giving financial backing to small businesses but because of the dependency on this funding by the voluntary sector. The bulk of funding for this sector is EU money, and there is a definite lack of will to adequately fund the sector from Government coffers. We need to address this immediately. The contribution made by this sector is immeasurable and totally under-valued, and its lifespan has not yet come to a natural end. We must ensure that provision is made to put the mainstream funding necessary into this sector immediately and for some years to come.
The minute increase in the Department for Social Development budget is not enough. We must target social need in all aspects of society and, given that this Department takes care of the most vulnerable and disadvantaged in our society, it is imperative that we put enough resources into it to eliminate poverty and restore self-confidence, dignity and justice to our local communities. Go raibh maith agat.
Mr Shannon:
I would like to discuss two issues. The first one relates to the Housing Executive's budget being cut. What worries me, as a representative for Strangford, is that with £13·7m being taken off the budget it is the rural economy that will suffer. There is money set aside for regeneration in Belfast but in the areas I represent the money is not there.
I want to know why the schemes are falling behind. Some have been on the list for five or six years. There are people waiting for heating schemes which, we were told, were going to be implemented in the next year and which we now find could be a year or two away. We have these problems right across the borough. Why is there this discrimination? Why is there unfair play with regard to my constituency when Belfast gets all the money it needs? The allocation of funds must be fair.
On the subject of funding, what about the funding required for occupational therapists to enable them to provide the services required. The finance must be available so that they can make visits and carry out the schemes. We seem to be falling behind on such issues. Has there been an allocation in the budget for this? £4·3 billion seems a lot of money - it is a lot of money - but when you see the areas where there is a need they have to be identified and the need dealt with.
Another area which has not been covered is fishing. The Minister, in his address to the Assembly, had one sentence on fishing. I am sure this does not reflect his interest in this particular part of the economy. I must express concern if it does. In Northern Ireland as a whole, there are perhaps 2,500 jobs directly related to fishing and an income from landings of perhaps £100 million. This is not small fry by any means, even though some people only ever see a fish when it is in batter and comes out of a chip shop. People in my constituency and across Northern Ireland want to know what funding is set aside for fishermen. The depth of feeling and concern in the fishing industry continues to grow in the face of Government unwillingness to properly address the issue. We can see from the budget exactly what is happening.
Many people depend entirely on the sea for their income. Portavogie, Ardglass, Kilkeel, Annalong and places along the north coast need fishing to survive. These places have no other option. The legislation emanating from Europe has been a deciding factor. I want to know what has been set aside to help the fishermen. I suspect very little.
No Member has mentioned the fishing industry today, but we have to realise the integral part that it contributes to Northern Ireland's economy. The local fisheries division based at Stormont has not proved itself to be friends of the fishermen. Indeed, its officials proved themselves to - dare I say it - have an arrogant and, perhaps, pompous attitude towards the fishermen. They do not listen to what happens on the ground, and they do not hear what the men are saying. They have also been overenthusiastic in pursuing EU directives, again to the detriment of the fishing industry. Contrast this against the very lax attitude in Spain when it comes to enforcing fishing rules and regulations. It is unfair that our fishermen should be pursued with such zeal, unlike other parts of Europe. That is unfair.
I also draw attention to the £70 million that will be spent by the Northern Ireland Office to provide a helicopter, an aeroplane and five Royal Navy vessels to ensure that the new legislation is maintained. Would it not be better to spend that £70 million on the fishing industry? Would it not be better to ensure that there is money for all those boats and jobs in order to boost the economy, rather than trying to crucify the fishermen, who, by the way, are agreeing to and following the rules and regulations? There is room for further regeneration and processing in the fishing industry.
What funding has been set aside in the Department of Agriculture and Rural Development for the specific task of helping the fishing industry, providing the jobs and giving the people the opportunities? I suspect there has been none, but I would like to know. It is of great concern that both Westminster and Europe have disregarded a strategy and do not seem to have any policy in relation to it. For instance, the number of boats in Portavogie has reduced from 95 to 55. Some of the boats in Northern Ireland's fishing industry, specifically those in Portavogie, are between 25 and 32 years old. What money has the Department set aside to upgrade the fishing boats? What money has the Department set aside to try to help the industry to get out of the doldrums it is in and look to the next 10, 15 or 20 years?
The Minister mentioned the money that comes through from Europe. What moneys has he set aside for the slipways, for the ice houses, for the upgrading of the facilities, for the dredging of the harbours, and for the provision of the new harbour walls? What money has been set aside for that? What is the fishing industry getting out of this deal? I suspect it is getting very little. The people that we represent would like to know exactly what is on the plate for them. We would like to know that as well. We want to see opportunities for young men and women to come into the fishing industry. But that has not been the case, because young men are leaving the fishing industry. They do not see a future in it, and they do not see the potential in it. Unless their fathers were to hand the boats over to them, in most cases they would not bother pursuing a job in the fishing industry. What facilities and opportunities have been made available for young people to go into the fishing industry? I would like to know the position on that.
In the short-term in relation to the European rules and regulations, an effective compensation system is required, similar to the one in Spain - one that takes people out of the industry for a short time and compensates them for that period. That is the sort of scheme we should have in Northern Ireland so that our people are not disenfranchised, just as they are not in Spain and elsewhere.
It is time that the Department woke up to what is happening and went to Europe with some semblance of desire to locate the necessary funding to alleviate the current crisis in fishing. In short, our fisheries representatives have caved in to Europe on every occasion and do not seem to be truly prepared to fight their corner and, indeed, our corner as well. I would love to be able to return to my constituency and to give people the assurances that the fishing industry is all right, that the is help there and that there is finance, so that the fishermen could feel that regeneration would be taking place in Portavogie and all the other harbours in Northern Ireland. But I suspect that is not the case.
4.45 pm
Many fishermen feel that they are discriminated against. They are asking over and over again "What moneys are available to keep our fishing industry going? What moneys are available to provide new jobs? What moneys are available for regeneration and for further processing?" I would like the Minister to answer those questions.
Mr J Kelly:
With reference to Ian Paisley Jnr's remarks about the education and rehabilitation of prisoners, may I remind him that it was the inflammatory rhetoric of his party that led many young Loyalists into prison. It is a bit rich for him to be talking in such derogatory terms about prisoners from any locality.
Sammy Wilson mentioned the Minister of Education giving money the day before suspension but made no mention of the DUP or of Nigel Dodds throwing £40 million at the Larne bypass. Nigel, who wants to make a "Mickey Marley's roundabout" of the Executive, was quite happy to give £40 million to the Larne area. A cheann Comhairle.
Sue Ramsey and I and other colleagues were meeting with the health authorities on an ongoing basis before and during suspension, but particularly during suspension. We have met with medical practitioners from all disciplines in the field. The consensus from those people is that the Health Service is sick. They are looking for a radical, root-and-branch reform of the Health Service. It was interesting that, coming from all backgrounds, they were looking for local solutions as distinct from British solutions. They were not just looking for local solutions for this part of the island of Ireland, but they were wondering how we could develop the health services in other parts of the island putting, perhaps, less stress on the finances required overall. The question of local accountability for health services came up again and again. They were particularly concerned with capital funding for equipment such as x-ray machines, scanners and such like, that we do not hear too much about.
In one case a machine was taken from the Throne Hospital, where it had been since 1963, and brought to the Royal Victoria Hospital. This gives us some insight into the real depth of deprivation within the Health Service. I know that the Minister has a limited budget and cannot do everything, but perhaps those are matters that could and should be critically addressed.
Reference has been made to tuition fees. It is my view, and the view of my party, that education is as much a part of the infrastructure as roads, electricity, rail and all the other elements that go to make up that infrastructure. Students should be the beneficiaries of our educational system and not the victims of it. Looking at education, and looking at all the difficulties that students face, education should be free, for all children. They are the people who are going to make up the society of the future and, if education is as essential as all other parts of our infrastructure, we should be looking at these issues in a very critical and serious way. We should not be attempting to penny-pinch with education.
Roads, a Cheann Comhairle, are of great concern to people west of the Bann - I say that as a representative of a constituency there. The current condition of the roads is a problem for people travelling. If you take the north-west corridor for example, and you get as far as Toome, what happens then? Then from Toome you try to get through Dungiven, or further up through the other villages and towns - it is a bottleneck by and large.
Compare that to roads structures in the Twenty-six Counties and the way in which they have been developed. The north-west is a vital corridor, and not because the Minister or John Hume comes from Derry. It is a vital corridor for tourism and the whole infrastructure of this part of the island, and it is something that we should look at seriously.
It impinges on all aspects and facets of our lives, particularly tourism, which we are trying to develop. If we are to encourage people to come to Larne and travel on, let us look at the road structures from Larne to the north-west, and how one manages to get through them. If there is a question of discretion, a Cheann Comhairle, then the Minister might look at those areas most in need of the updating and refurbishment of their roads.
The IDB situation, and the question of accountability within it, leaves much to be desired. For example, Desmond and Sons closed a shirt factory in Magherafelt with the loss of some 80 jobs. A total of 1,500 jobs have been lost in textiles in the south Derry/Magherafelt District Council area over the last three years.
The factory was sold by Desmond and Sons to a man who wishes to use it as a bingo hall. It had contained machinery and all the elements needed for another entrepreneur to take over and provide employment. However, Desmond and Sons sold it, and it will now be used as a bingo hall. When I questioned the background to this, I discovered that the IDB had actually invested £3·8 million in this factory, and when I asked what had happened to the £3·8 million, I was told that it had gone past its sell-by date. In other words, it cannot claw back the £3·8 million, because the sell-by date has gone. Desmond and Sons therefore not only has the £3·8 million, but also the profits from a factory that it sold for a bingo hall. When one questions the company about that, one does not receive any satisfactory explanation for it.
There is also the question of the IDB's lack of enthusiasm for providing industrial development land within the Magherafelt District Council area. No matter how often we talk to its officials, we find that there is some reason relating to finance why they cannot do it. Then we find that £3·8 million has gone down the tubes.
Water and sewerage are also questions, a Cheann Comhairle, critical to the rural population. It is amazing that, in the year 2000, there are people in rural communities without running water or sewerage. They depend on a septic tank - and these are clusters of houses. Where that situation exists with no proper sewerage system it leads, of course to other environmental problems. I could go on and give the Minister a headache - if he so wished - about the problems besetting this community after 30, 40, or perhaps even 50 years of neglect. They must be addressed urgently. David Ford has gone, but he did not do too badly for a man who called this a sham - he spoke for about ten minutes. But he was right to call this a sham. He is right to say that the whole system in this part of the island requires money far and beyond that contained in the Estimates. I know that is not the Minister's fault, but it is not there at the moment. It is something we should be looking at extremely seriously.
Mr Morrow:
I am sure Mr Durkan will leave the Assembly today wondering just what he has to do. He has brought forward a package of some £4·3 billion, and yet everyone tells him it is not quite enough. That is right, Mr Durkan, it is not quite enough. Bring forward £10 billion and we will spend it for you. We will give you the programme all right.
I should, however, like first of all to deal with some remarks Mr Kelly made against my Colleague Ian Paisley Jnr.
He chose to make them when my Colleague was not here. He said that it was rhetoric for Members of the DUP to say that some people had to be put behind bars to necessitate their rehabilitation. I say to Mr Kelly that it was rhetoric and action from his cohorts that put people in their grave, and that they have no opportunity of being rehabilitated - they have been permanently removed from society. Perhaps he will keep that in mind when he makes his utterances in the House. They have a very hollow ring and they will not -
Mr J Kelly:
Will the Member give way?
Mr Speaker:
It is a matter for the Member whether he will give way.
Mr Morrow:
No, I am not giving way. Those remarks will not find much credence or respect from this side of the House.
There are a number of points that I want to make. I was interested to hear Mr Poots say that money that was generated in planning was spent in that same area. Why can it not be the same for money from the sale of Housing Executive houses? We are told that money is not spent from that budget, or if it is, it is certainly not used to replace properties. We now have a frightening situation in which virtually no public housing is available because no new houses are being built, which will lead in a very short time to another crisis in housing. Many people are desperate for housing. I am sure that Members have examples of constituents coming to them, telling them that they have been waiting for housing for two to four years. I had an example of that only last week. It is very difficult to reassure people that one day they will be housed when I know that in my constituency, and in the area in which they are looking for a house, no houses are being built. Indeed, no new houses have been planned for the next five-year programme. This issue has to be addressed.
As for the roads infrastructure in rural communities, I smile when I hear those who represent urban constituencies talk about a poor service from public transport. We have no railways in my constituency. There are no trains. If some of my constituents want to see a bus they have to rush out to their gate to see one going past every two or three weeks. That is the sort of service that we receive from public transport. Therefore, I feel that we do have something to gripe about when we say that public transport is totally inadequate. That matter has to be given very serious consideration.
Instead of hospitals being upgraded and new ones built, a rural dweller will find to his dismay that existing ones are being closed. That is another penalty for the rural dweller.
Children who want to go to a rural primary school find that their schools too are under the chop. Small Protestant schools in particular are being continually run down and closed. That is another penalty for being a rural dweller.
Agriculture has gone through one of the worst crises in its history, but we are told that the way out is for farmers to be more innovative. They must diversify and change. Farmers are quite prepared to diversify, to be innovative and to change, but alas, they are not being given the opportunity.
5.00 pm
Many farmers find that they have to sell off plots of land as building sites in order to maintain a living. Yet, when they seek planning permission, do they get any comfort, support or encouragement? Alas, they do not. Many are told that they are living in green belt areas and that the policy in such areas is being stringently adhered to. Any time farmers take the opportunity to lift themselves out of their difficulties they are told that they cannot do it because of planning legislation.
The rural dweller will not fare any better in the future than he has in the past. I would like to see expenditure being targeted to areas where there are needs crying out. We have listed some of them and there are others. The textile industry has been mentioned. It is going through another crisis. Experts tell us that much of our textile industry will disappear within a three year period. What package has been drawn up to alleviate that or to ensure that it does not happen? What package will ensure that our factories, which bring much needed work to areas, do not become desolate, rundown factory shelves?
For 30 years the rural community has suffered from underfunding - at times I believe that has been deliberate - to encourage people out of the rural areas and into towns and villages. That is quite iniquitous. It cannot, and will not, be tolerated. Those who have been brought up in the countryside and have earned their living there, and in rural communities, should be encouraged and given every incentive to ensure that they can stay there. Do we want our rural areas to become a wasteland? Do we want to see no more rural schools, or more hospitals closed, even in what we deem to be medium to large size towns? Do we want to find that the whole thing has been centralised, with people being pushed and orientated in a direction in which they have no desire to go? I feel that in the future the Minister should apply himself to these issues so as to ensure that everyone gets a fair crack of the whip, particularly the rural dwellers who, to date, have been left to the side as if they do not matter.
Ms Ramsey:
Go raibh maith agat. I initially welcome the increase in the budget allocation which the Minister of Finance, Mr Mark Durkan, indicated he would give to the Department of Health, Social Services and Public Safety. We need to be aware that there has traditionally been an underspend on health and social services, which has been recognised lately by the British Prime Minister, Tony Blair.
In previous years British Ministers have underfunded the Department of Health and the result of this is long hospital waiting lists, including those for occupational therapy and care in the community, as well as the underfunding of initiatives such as the Children Order.
Even though the Department of Health, Social Services and Public Safety commands a major part of the overall budget, a large percentage is eaten up by the acute sector. As was pointed out earlier, in recent years everyone accepted that the Eastern Health and Social Services Board has been underfunded. Some people say that it has been underfunded to the tune of £15 million.
Within the Eastern Health and Social Services Board area it is accepted that the North and West Belfast Health and Social Services Trust has been traditionally underfunded. Due to the lack of money made available in previous years to the Department, especially in the area of children's services, let us be in no doubt that these services have been, and continue to be, in a state of crisis.
During presentations to the Health, Social Services and Public Safety Committee, all the health boards expressed concern that they are failing to meet their statutory and moral duty under the Children Order owing to the lack of resources and finance.
Residential care is another major concern, as other Members pointed out. The Chairperson of the Health, Social Services and Public Safety Committee stated that it will carry out a hearing into children's services. I am sure that, once again, the main themes of this hearing will be lack of money and resources, especially under the Children Order.
I am sure Mr Durkan is fed up hearing that this morning, but I wish to point out that it is up to local people to undo the years of underfunding by British Ministers. It is crucial that everyone's entitlement to a quality Health Service be recognised. Health is the cornerstone of our lives and those of our children.
I am concerned that any additional money that can be given by the Minister to the Minister of Health may be ring-fenced as in previous years. This must be done properly, since we have seen money supposedly ring-fenced for children's services being used to pay off debts, balance the books and put a nice smile on bad management in the trusts and boards.
I ask the Minister to direct his attention to the financial crisis currently affecting all aspects of children's lives.
Mr Maskey:
Go raibh maith agat, a Cheann Comhairle. I shall be very brief. The IDB was mentioned earlier, and the report from the Public Accounts Committee in Westminster certainly drew attention to some of the difficulties experienced with the money it spent. That affected my constituency in West Belfast, where IDB spending per job ran to the tune of £50,000. Owing to the accelerated passage and nature of this Bill, I should like to set it on record that the IDB will have to work more closely with local organisations, enterprises or partnerships towards ensuring that job creation is improved or enhanced. In other words, the IDB must work with the strategies which local communities, it is to be hoped, spearhead and drive.
Even in the context of TSN, the IDB's report talks not of trying to locate industry in areas of need or disadvantage, but rather in or around them. My understanding is that almost the entire Six County area is taken as an area of disadvantage. In the future, for the IDB to get best value while of course relating to TSN, there must be more area-specific targeting of employment opportunities and working with communities and other enterprises - either through local partnerships or elected representatives - to ensure that job creation is better focused. In my constituency, a substantial amount of money has been directed at organisations like Mackie, which collapsed, or to consolidate jobs at Bass Ireland or even the Ford Motor Company. However, it is my understanding that there has been a net loss of jobs in west Belfast in the past year or so. I ask the Minister of Finance and Personnel to ensure best value in the future from the IDB on social need targets. We want the IDB to work better with communities than in the past. We take the question of disadvantaged areas seriously and therefore ask IDB to try to be more specific in locating job opportunities in the future.
The Minister of Finance and Personnel (Mr Durkan):
Having sat through this debate I have some sympathy for you, Mr Speaker - perhaps more than before.
I was listening, however. I do not mean this to be the Frazier Crane idea of listening, but I was doing so, and those points I do not have time to answer fully and properly will be followed up by my Department and me, or by the respective departmental Ministers. I take Mrs Nelis's point that many of the remarks were made not so much because people were trying to change the Estimates - rather they were laying down markers for future budgetary considerations.
Today has clearly been useful. The debate has been constructive and responsible. The Estimates are complex and difficult, but I have been impressed by the uniformly high quality of the contributions from all the Assembly parties taking part.
The public can take heart from the fact that their representatives have demonstrated today that they can work effectively to ensure that key public services are sustained and scrutinised. During the course of the debate Members have raised a considerable number of issues, concerns and ideas, and, as I indicated in my opening remarks, I will try to deal with as many of these as possible in the time available. Where this is not possible we will try to provide a written response.
First, I would like to deal with some of the issues of general concern that were raised by Members. Mr Molloy, as Chairman of the Committee on Finance and Personnel, raised the important issue of the process and timetable for the 2000 spending review. This was also of concern to other Members, including Dr Birnie. Nearly all the Committee Chairpersons who contributed were raising questions, not just in relation to their concerns about the lack of opportunity that they had in this process at Committee level, but they also wanted to know when the Committees were going to find time to have their say in relation to the 2000 spending review. I fully intend to do all that is reasonably possible to ensure that the Assembly and its Committees can properly fulfil their important responsibilities in the spending review. Clearly it would be desirable for the Assembly to have defined financial procedures, and I am fully committed to assisting the Assembly in the consideration and development of such procedures and will certainly work with all relevant Committees and persons in the Assembly to that end.
As we face the 2000 spending review the broad outline of the timetable is as follows. From the end of June into July the United Kingdom spending review will conclude, and Northern Ireland's allocations for the next three years will then be known. From July to October there will be the consideration of Northern Ireland spending priorities, aligned with the work that will be taking place on developing the Programme for Government. In October we need to be looking at the formal presentation of the budget for consideration by the Assembly, with the 2001-02 budgets being settled in early December. Obviously within that broad timetable we will need to ensure an appropriate opportunity for consultation, examination and discussion.
Mr P Doherty raised the need to secure the maximum resources to meet the needs of public services, and he was not the only Member who spoke in the debate to highlight this issue. It was mentioned all the way through, right up until Mr Morrow's contribution. We are all concerned about this matter. The Executive will do all in its power to ensure that we receive a fair share of public expenditure, and we will also look carefully at the scope for raising additional resources by our own efforts. However, to be frank, there will never be enough resources to do all that we will wish to do, and that is why we have to pursue efficiency and the elimination of waste with all possible rigour. We will also have to prioritise our spending so that the most important actions and needy areas are addressed first. Hard decisions will be needed, and that is why an agreed Programme for Government is crucial to the process, a fact that Mr Ford identified in his contribution.
Turning to some more specific issues raised by Members, Mr Neeson raised questions on public transport, as did many others. He expressed concern, particularly in relation to railways, and asked what more could be done. Mr A Maginness, among others, followed this up. I fully agree with those sentiments. An efficient and effective transport system is vital to the Northern Ireland economy and to public life. Significant new investment is needed to improve public transport and the roads infrastructure, but consideration of the proper level of investment necessary must await the outcome of the railways taskforce report which is due in the summer.
Mr Neeson and Dr Hendron also referred to the uncertainty regarding the future of hospital services and the particular problem with waiting lists. The future of hospital services is a key issue and one that needs to be addressed as a matter of urgency.
It is important that we do all we can to ensure safe and effective hospital services for all our people. I am aware that Northern Ireland has a particular waiting list problem. This is one of a range of pressures faced by the Department of Health and Social Services. I understand that the Department of Health, Social Services and Public Safety is working to develop ways of tackling this problem.