PUBLIC ACCOUNTS COMMITEE
MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS
THURSDAY, 28 FEBRUARY 2008
ROOM 144, PARLIAMENT BUILDINGS
Present: Mr John O’Dowd (Chairperson)
Mr Roy Beggs (Deputy Chairperson)
Mr Jonathan Craig
Mr John Dallat
Mr Simon Hamilton
Mr David Hilditch
Mr Ian McCrea
Mr Mitchel McLaughlin
In Attendance: Mr Jim Beatty (Assembly Clerk)
Mrs Gillian Lewis (Assistant Assembly Clerk)
Mrs Nicola Shephard (Clerical Supervisor)
Mr Ricky Shek (Clerical Officer)
Apologies: Mr Trevor Lunn
Mr Patsy McGlone
Ms Dawn Purvis
The meeting opened at 2.00pm in public session.
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Apologies.
Apologies are listed above.
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Minutes of the meeting on 21 February 2008.
Agreed: The minutes were agreed.
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Matters arising.
The Committee noted correspondence from the Accounting Officer, Department of the Environment, providing further information in relation to the Memorandum of Response (MOR): Control of River Pollution in Northern Ireland.
Agreed: Members agreed that they would raise some issues of concern with the Accounting Officer at a future evidence session and in the meantime NIAO would keep the matter under review.
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Consideration of Memorandum of Response on the Committee’s Report on Transfer of Surplus Land in the PFI Education Pathfinder Projects.
Members considered the response to the Committee’s Report on Transfer of Surplus Land in the PFI Education Pathfinder Projects. Witnesses attending were Mr John Dowdall CB, Comptroller and Auditor General (C&AG), Mr Brandon McMaster, Director of Value for Money, Mr Eddie Bradley, Director of Value for Money, and Mr Joe Campbell, Audit Manager, NIAO.
Agreed: Members agreed to obtain an update on the progress against the Department’s response to the Committee’s recommendation in twelve months.
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Briefing on the NIAO report ‘Good Governance – Effective Relationships between Departments and their Arm’s Length Bodies’.
Mr Beggs declared an interest as his father is Chairperson of an Education and Library Board, and he sits on Carrickfergus Borough Council which has received monies from some of the departments’ arm’s length bodies.
Mr Hilditch declared an interest in that he sits on a number of organisations which have drawn down monies from the Sports Council and Northern Ireland Events Company (NIEC).
Mr McCrea declared an interest in that Cookstown Borough Council has received monies from some of the departments’ arm’s length bodies.
Mr John Dowdall CB, C&AG, Mr Eddie Bradley, Director of Value for Money, Mr Stephen McCormick, Director, and Mr David Murdie, Audit Manager, briefed the Committee on the NIAO Report, ‘Good Governance – Effective Relationships between Departments and their Arm’s Length Bodies’, and answered members’ questions.
Agreed: Members agreed that at next week’s evidence session they would first question the witnesses on the NIAO report and secondly on the NIEC.
2.17pm The meeting went in to closed session.
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Issues arising from oral evidence session on the NIAO Report ‘Social Security Benefit Fraud and Error’.
Members discussed issues relating to the evidence session.
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Consideration of the Committee’s Draft Report into Older People and Domiciliary Care.
Members considered the draft report paragraph by paragraph. The witnesses attending were Mr John Dowdall CB, C&AG, Mr Sean McKay, Director of Value for Money, Ms Clare Dornan, Audit Manager, and Mr Joe Campbell, Audit Manager, NIAO.
The Committee considered the main body of the report.
Paragraph 1 read and agreed.
Paragraph 2 read, amended and agreed.
Paragraphs 3 - 6 read and agreed.
2.55pm Mr Hamilton joined the meeting.
Paragraphs 7 – 13 read and agreed.
Paragraph 14 read, amended and agreed.
Paragraphs 15 – 21 read and agreed.
Paragraph 22 read, amended and agreed.
Paragraph 23 read and agreed.
Paragraphs 24 and 25 read, amended and agreed.
Paragraphs 26 and 29 read and agreed.
Paragraph 30 read, amended and agreed.
Paragraphs 31 and 32 read and agreed.
Paragraphs 33 – 35 read, amended and agreed.
Paragraph 36 read and agreed.
Paragraph 37 read, amended and agreed.
Paragraph 38 read and agreed.
Paragraphs 39 and 40 read, amended and agreed.
Paragraphs 41 - 45 read and agreed.
Paragraph 46 read, amended and agreed.
Paragraph 47 read and agreed.
Paragraph 48 read, amended and agreed.
Paragraphs 49 – 53 read and agreed.
Paragraph 55 read, amended and agreed.
Paragraph 56 read and agreed.
3.45pm Mr McCrea left the meeting.
Paragraph 54 read, amended and agreed.
The Committee considered the Executive Summary of the report.
Paragraph 1 read, amended and agreed.
Paragraphs 2 - 9 read and agreed.
Paragraphs 10 and 11 read, amended and agreed.
3.52pm Mr McCrea rejoined the meeting.
Paragraph 12 read, amended and agreed.
Paragraphs 13 - 17 read and agreed.
Paragraph 18 read, amended and agreed.
Agreed: Members ordered the report to be printed.
Agreed: Members agreed that the Chairperson’s letter requesting additional information and the response from the Accounting Officer, Department of Health, Social Services and Public Safety, and the letter from the UK Home Care Association Ltd, would be included in the Committee’s report.
Agreed: Members agreed to embargo the report until 00.01am on 10 April 2008, when the report would be officially released.
Agreed: Members agreed that they would not hold a press conference.
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Any other business.
Members considered the venue for the meeting on 1 May 2008.
Agreed: Members agreed that the meeting should take place in the Senate Chamber, Parliament Buildings.
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Date, time and place of next meeting.
The next meeting will be held on Thursday, 6 March 2008 at 2.00pm in the Senate Chamber, Parliament Buildings.
The Chairperson adjourned the meeting at 4.00pm.