PUBLIC ACCOUNTS COMMITEE
MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS
Thursday, 4 September 2008
Room 144, PARLIAMENT BUILDINGS
Present:
Mr Paul Maskey (Chairperson)
Mr Roy Beggs (Deputy Chairperson)
Mr John Dallat
Mr Trevor Lunn
Mr Mitchel McLaughlin
In Attendance:
Mr Jim Beatty (Assembly Clerk)
Mrs Gillian Lewis (Assistant Assembly Clerk)
Mr John Lunny (Clerical Supervisor)
Mr Darren Weir (Clerical Officer)
Apologies:
Mr Simon Hamilton
Mr David Hilditch
Ms Dawn Purvis
The meeting opened at 2.08pm in public session.
1. Apologies.
Apologies are listed above.
2. Chairperson’s business.
The Chairperson informed members that Mrs Cathie White has transferred to take up the position of Clerk with the Committee for the Office of First Minister and deputy First Minister. Members wished Mrs White well in her new post. Members also noted that Mrs Nicola Shephard has transferred to the Office of the Commission on promotion and Mr John Lunny has returned to the Committee staff.
3. Minutes of the meeting on 3 July 2008.
Agreed: The minutes were agreed.
4. Matters arising.
Members considered and agreed the forward work programme for the period September to December 2008.
The Chairperson informed members that the Senate Chamber is not available to the Committee for the evidence session on 23 October 2008.
Agreed: Members agreed that the Committee staff would provide some options on locations for consideration by members at the next meeting.
Members considered a list of NIAO reports on which they would not be able to take oral evidence, and which will be dealt with by the Committee by correspondence in future composite reports.
Agreed: Members agreed that the Committee staff will prioritise these reports for future composite reports and come back to the Committee.
5. Consideration of Memorandum of Reply (MOR) on the Committee’s Reports (a) The Use of Operating Theatres in the Northern Ireland Health and Personal Social Services, and (b) Social Security Agency: Benefit Fraud and Error.
Members considered the responses to the Committee’s Reports (a) The Use of Operating Theatres in the Northern Ireland Health and Personal Social Services, and (b) Social Security Agency: Benefit Fraud and Error. The witness attending was Mr Kieran Donnelly, Deputy C&AG.
Agreed: Members agreed to write to the Department in relation to recommendation 17 of the MOR on Social Security Agency: Benefit Fraud and Error.
Agreed: Members agreed to obtain an update on the progress against the Departments’ responses to the Committee’s recommendations to both reports in due course.
6. Consideration of Memorandum of Reply on the Committee Report on Good Governance – Effective Relationships between Departments and their Arm’s Length Bodies.
Members considered the response to the Committee’s Report on Good Governance – Effective Relationships between Departments and their Arm’s Length Bodies. The witness attending was Mr Kieran Donnelly, Deputy C&AG.
Agreed: Members agreed to obtain an update on the progress against the Department’s responses to the Committee’s recommendations in due course.
2.30pm The meeting went into closed session.
7. Consideration of the Committee’s Draft First Composite Report.
Members considered the draft report paragraph by paragraph.
The Committee considered the main body of the report.
Paragraphs 1 – 9 read and agreed.
Paragraph 10 read, amended and agreed.
Paragraphs 11 – 15 read and agreed.
Agreed: Members agreed to ask for a written update of the statistical information provided by the Department of Health, Social Services and Public Safety on Incorrect Claims for Exemption from Health Service Charges and whether the target date for the roll out of the Electronic Prescribing and Eligibility System had been met.
Agreed: Members agreed to obtain a briefing on the outworking of the Welsh system of free prescriptions.
Paragraphs 16 – 22 read and agreed.
Paragraphs 23 – 26 read, amended and agreed.
Paragraphs 27 - 31 read and agreed.
Paragraph 32 read, amended and agreed.
Paragraphs 33 – 40 read and agreed.
Paragraph 41 read, amended and agreed.
Paragraphs 42 – 51 read and agreed.
Paragraph 52 read, amended and agreed.
Paragraphs 53 – 55 read and agreed.
The Committee considered the Executive Summary.
Paragraphs 1 – 6 read and agreed.
Agreed: Members ordered the report to be printed.
Agreed: Members agreed that the Chairperson’s letters requesting information to the Accounting Officers, Department of Education, Department of Health, Social Services and Public Safety, Department of Agriculture and Rural Development, Department for Social Development, Department of Culture, Arts and Leisure, and Department for the Environment, and their responses would be included in the Committee’s report.
Agreed: Members agreed to embargo the report until 00.01am on Thursday, 25 September 2008, when the report would be officially released.
Agreed: Members agreed not to hold a press conference on Thursday, 25 September 2008 to launch the Committee’s report.
8. Motion for Debate
Members considered a Motion for Debate for the Assembly to note the reports published by the Public Accounts Committee since its first meeting in May 2007, and its consideration of the Memoranda of Reply from the Department of Finance and Personnel in relation to the Committee reports.
Agreed: Members agreed the Motion for Debate and that it would be forwarded to the Business Office for inclusion in a future Plenary session.
9. Any other business.
The Chairperson informed members that the NIAO has invited some senior American Civil Servants to Parliament Buildings on Wednesday, 17 September 2008 and would like to invite members to join the group for a short session.
Agreed: Members agreed that the Clerk would email final details as soon as possible.
10. Date, time and place of next meeting.
The next meeting will be held on Thursday, 11 September 2008 at 2.00pm in Room 144, Parliament Buildings.
The Chairperson adjourned the meeting at 3.18pm.