Present: Mr Francie Molloy (Chairman)
Mr Seamus Close
Mr Derek Hussey
Mr Roger Hutchinson
Ms Patricia Lewsley
Mr Maurice Morrow
Mr Peter Weir

In attendance: Mr Alan Patterson (Principal Clerk)
Mr Peter Hughes (Clerk)
Ms Sheila Mc Clelland (Clerk)
Mr Joe Sloan (Assistant Clerk)
Ms Sharon Bowman (Executive Support
Mr Jonathan Briggs (Administrative Support)

1. Apologies.

1.1 Mr James Leslie and Mr Billy Bell.

2. Minutes of Proceedings.

2.1 Resolved: The Committee agreed the Minutes of Proceedings of 27 November 2001.

3. Matters arising.

3.1 The Committee noted the letter sent to the Minister of Finance and Personnel regarding the proposed Peace II allocations to Local Strategy Partnerships which raised the Committee's concerns about the formula, rural proofing and New TSN, evaluation and redistribution of unallocated resources and administration costs.

3.2 The Committee noted the letter sent to the Minister of Finance and Personnel raising its concerns about the slippage in time-scales for the Review of Rating Policy. The letter also expressed the need for consultation at each stage of the Review with adequate time built in for consultation with other Statutory Committees.

3.3 The Committee noted the letter sent to the Department requesting a written response to the Human Rights Commission's consultation document on a proposed Bill of Rights.

3.4 The Committee noted the letter sent to the Department requesting a written response to the questions raised in the Committee of the Centre's European Inquiry Questionnaire.

3.5 The Committee considered the draft terms of reference for the appointment of a specialist adviser to assist the Committee to undertake a scrutiny study into the Review of Rating Policy.

3.6 Resolved: The Committee agreed the terms of reference for the appointment of a specialist adviser.

Mr Hussey attended the meeting at 2.46 p.m. Mr Morrow left the meeting at 2.46 p.m.

4. Revised Budget 2002/03.

4.1 The Minister of Finance and Personnel and Departmental officials, Dr Andrew McCormick, Mr Norman Taylor, Mr Richard Pengelly and Miss Adrianne Brown, attended the meeting and provided briefing and answered questions on the Revised Budget 2002/03.

4.2 The Minister discussed the changes between the Draft Budget in September 2001 and the Revised Budget presented on 3 December 2001. The Minister outlined the increases made to the allocations for Health, as the result of additional funds made available by the Executive and by Treasury, for Environment, by the restoration of £2m for the resource grant, for Culture, Arts and Leisure, for the additional pay costs for library staff and for Employment, for Primary 2 classroom assistants.

4.3 The Minister discussed the decision to reduce 2003/04 financial year indicative allocations for Departments by £125m to allow the Executive greater discretion on how resources should be allocated to meet identified high priority needs in the future. Future allocations would be informed by the Needs and Effectiveness evaluations he had announced.

Ms Lewsley attended the meeting at 3.11 p.m. Mr Weir left the meeting at 3.11 p.m.

4.4 The Minister discussed asset disposal and described how Resource Accounting would require Departments not only to control spend but to take account of asset depreciation.

Mr Weir returned to the meeting at 3.19 p.m.

4.5 The Minister discussed monitoring round bids and Executive Programmes Fund bids in the context of the Assembly having transparency and ability to evaluate the effectiveness of funds being provided for particular objectives. Needs and Effectiveness Evaluations and continued scrutiny by Statutory Departmental Committees would add to the transparency and Committees should not need to be invited to carry this out.

4.6 The Minister also advised the Committee of the outcome of discussions to date with Treasury on the introduction of Aggregates Tax in Northern Ireland and of the nomination by the Irish Congress of Trade Unions to the Public Private Partnerships Working Group.

5. Executive Programme Funds - Tranche 2 Allocations.

5.1 The Minister discussed the Assembly procedural arrangement, which meant that the statements on the Budget and Executive Programme Funds were separated in the plenary session and how this presented difficulties because EPF figures were referred to in the Budget statement.

Mr Hutchinson left the meeting at 3.43 p.m.

5.2 The Minister advised the Committee that more work was needed to develop appropriate structure for dealing with cross cutting ideas so that collaboration between Departments took place. He also advised the Committee that bids from Non Departmental Public Bodies (NDPBs) could also receive mainstream funding from Departments and from Executive Programme Funds. Each Department will have its own procedure for consulting such bodies.

Mr Morrow and Mr Hutchinson returned to the meeting and Ms Lewsley left the meeting at 3.58 p.m

6. Programme for Government

6.1 The Minister discussed the Department's Public Service Agreement contained in the Programme for Government and his response to the Committee dated 30 November 2001 on issues raised in its letter of 18 November 2001.

6.2 The Minister advised the Committee of the change of date for the Review of Rating Policy from July 2002 to November 2002. He outlined some further civil law Bills which would be presented in the coming financial year

The Chairman thanked the Minister for his co-operation in his dealings with the Committee and wished him well in his new role as Deputy First Minister.

The Minister responded by thanking the Committee and its staff for its positive and common sense approach to matters presented to it and for its constructive responses.

7. Northern Ireland Civil Service Human Resource Strategy

7.1 Departmental official, Mr David Trelford, briefed the Committee on the progress made by the Department on the review of the NICS Human Resource Strategy set out in the Programme for Government.

7.2 Mr Trelford described the four key themes of Resourcing, Learning, Inclusion and Leadership identified during consultation with the NICS Departments, which was included in the draft document presented to the Committee today. The Review will continue to finalise the document this month, then return in January 2002 to NICS Personnel Directors to agree the actions which need to be taken to address the key issues. The Review Team will consult with the Committee again in February 2002.

7.3 Mr Trelford answered questions from the Committee in relation to interchange of staff between the public and private sectors, graduate and administration grade recruitment, manpower planning and how the strategy would impact on absenteeism.

8. Transfer of Undertakings and Protection of Employment (TUPE)

8.1 Departmental officials Dr Jim Livingstone and Mr James Graham attended the meeting and discussed the Government's proposals for reform of the TUPE Regulations 1981. Dr Livingstone informed the Committee that when staff transferred from the public service under PPPs, their terms and conditions of employment were protected under TUPE. This did not legally extend to pensions, although, to date transfers have taken place on the basis that the staff are provided with broadly comparable pensions. The new legislation addressed that issue.

8.2 The officials answered questions from the Committee on the legislation.

8.3 Resolved: The Committee agreed that it did not wish to make a contribution to the consultation by the Department of Education and Learning on the reform of TUPE legislation.

27 November 2001 / Menu / 8 January 2002