COMMITTEE FOR SOCIAL DEVELOPMENT
MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS
THURSDAY 21 OCTOBER 2010
ROOM 29, PARLIAMENT BUILDINGS
Present:
Mr Simon Hamilton MLA (Chairperson)
Mr Sydney Anderson MLA
Mrs Mary Bradley MLA
Mr Mickey Brady MLA
Mr Jonathan Craig MLA
Mr Alex Easton MLA
Mr Tommy Gallagher MLA
Ms Anna Lo MLA
Ms Carál Ní Chuilín MLA
Mr Fra McCann MLA
In Attendance:
Mr Peter McCallion (Assembly Clerk)
Mrs Clairita Frazer (Assistant Assembly Clerk)
Mr Stewart Kennedy (Clerical Supervisor)
Ms Allison Ferguson (Clerical Officer)
Mrs Sian Woodward (Bill Clerk – agenda items 1-5)
Apologies:
None
The meeting commenced at 9.38am in open session.
1. Apologies
No apologies were received.
2.Chairperson’s Business
None
3. Draft minutes of the meeting held on 14 October 2010
Agreed: The minutes of the meeting held on Thursday, 14 October 2010 were agreed.
4. Matters arising
Press Release: Affordable Housing Seminar
Agreed: The Committee noted a Committee press release relating to the Affordable Housing Seminar arranged by Assembly Research and Library Services and the Chartered Institute of Housing.
5. Caravans Bill – Clause-by-Clause Scrutiny
The following Departmental officials joined the meeting at 9.41am:
Mr Stephen Martin Housing Division, Department for Social Development;
Mr Colm McQuillan Assistant Director, Northern Ireland Housing Executive; and
Mr Connor Smith Principal Officer, Travellers Project Team, Northern Ireland Housing Executive.
Mr Anderson joined the meeting at 9.47am.
The Committee noted a response from the Department on the Caravans Bill and advice from Assembly Legal Services on adverse possession.
Mr Easton joined the meeting at 9.54am.
Mr Anderson declared an interest as a Member of Craigavon Borough Council at 9.56am.
Mrs Bradley joined the meeting at 9.59am.
Mr Gallagher joined the meeting at 10.01am.
Noted: The Committee noted assurances from the Housing Executive that the Caravans Bill will not lead to unmanageable difficulties for the Housing Executive in its management of Travellers caravan sites nor will the Bill precipitate a change in eviction policy or practice in respect of transit or emergency halting sites.
The Chairperson thanked the officials from the Housing Executive.
The officials from the Housing Executive left the meeting at 10.06am.
Mr McCann left the meeting at 10.06am.
Agreed: The Committee therefore agreed that the formal clause-by-clause scrutiny of the Caravans Bill should commence.
Mr Martin remained at table to assist Members during clause-by-clause scrutiny.
Part 1: Agreements for Residential Occupiers on Protected Sites
Clause 1: Application of this Part
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it would not support amendments which would exempt Housing Executive transit and emergency halting sites from the protections of Part 1 of the Bill.
Agreed: The Committee further agreed that it would support Departmental amendments which would limit the protections of Part 1 of the Bill to those who are entitled to station a caravan on a protected site where the caravan was their only or main residence for a period exceeding 1 year.
“Question put and agreed to: that the Committee for Social Development has considered and agreed an amendment to Clause 1, namely:
Clause 1, page 1, line 8, leave out ‘3’ and insert ‘12’ ”
“Question: Subject to other consequential amendment, the Committee is content with Clause 1 as amended, put and agreed to.”
Clause 2: Particulars of Agreements
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it would not support amendments in relation to the delay of commencement and the inclusion of agreement proformas in the schedules of the Bill.
“Question: Subject to consequential amendment, the Committee is content with Clause 2 as drafted, put and agreed to.”
Clause 3: Terms of agreements
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it would not support amendments in relation to the exemption of NIHE emergency halting and transit sites from the protections of Part 1 of the Bill or amendments which would specifically facilitate the recovery of pitches on such sites.
“Question: Subject to consequential amendment, the Committee is content with Clause 3 as drafted, put and agreed to.”
Mr McCann rejoined the meeting at 10.10am.
Clause 4: Power to amend implied terms
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it supported an amendment which would require the Department to review the operation of the residential agreements, within 5 years of commencement, as set out in Part 1 and the Schedule of the Bill.
“Question put and agreed to: that the Committee for Social Development has agreed an amendment to Clause 4, namely:
Clause 4, page 3, line 42, at end insert -
‘(6) The Department for Social Development shall -
(a) not later than 5 years after the coming into operation of this Act, and
(b) at least once in every period of 5 years thereafter,
review Parts 1 and 2 of the Schedule and determine whether it should exercise the power to make an order under this section.”
“Question: Subject to other consequential amendment, the Committee is content with Clause 4 as amended, put and agreed to.”
Clause 5: Successors in title
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it would not support amendments which would disapply the successors in title provisions to NIHE Travellers sites.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it would support a Departmental amendment to allow NIHE some structured discretion in the application of the relevant clause.
“Question put and agreed to: that the Committee for Social Development has agreed an amendment to Clause 5, namely:
Clause 5, page 4, line 7, leave out subsections (3) to (5) and insert -
‘(3) The following subsections apply where a person entitled to the benefit of and bound by a residential agreement dies at a time when that person is occupying the caravan as that person’s only or main residence; and in those subsections -
(a) that person is referred to as “the deceased”;
(b) references to “the beneficiary” of the deceased are to the person entitled to the caravan by virtue of the deceased ’ s will or under the law relating to intestacy;
(c) references to “a travellers’ site” are to a caravan site provided and managed by the Northern Ireland Housing Executive under Article 28A of the Housing (Northern Ireland) Order 1981 (caravan sites for members of Irish Traveller community); and
(d) a beneficiary of the deceased is a qualifying person if the beneficiary satisfies the Housing Executive that the beneficiary -
(i) is a member of the Irish Traveller community (within the meaning of Article 5 of the Race Relations (Northern Ireland) Order 1997); and
(ii) intends to occupy the caravan as the beneficiary’s only or main residence.
(4) The agreement has effect for the benefit of and is binding on any person residing with the deceased at the time of death who is -
(a) the surviving spouse or civil partner of the deceased; or
(b) if there is no surviving spouse or civil partner so residing, a member of the deceased ’ s family.
(5) If -
(a) there is no person falling within subsection (4); and
(b) the agreement relates to a caravan on a caravan site other than a travellers’ site,
the agreement has effect for the benefit of and is binding on the beneficiary of the deceased, but subject to subsection (7).
(6) If -
(a) there is no person falling within subsection (4);
(b) the agreement relates to a caravan on a travellers’ site, and
(c) the beneficiary of the deceased is a qualifying person,
the agreement has effect for the benefit of and is binding on the beneficiary of the deceased.
(7) A residential agreement does not have effect for the benefit of or bind a person by virtue of subsection (5) in so far as -
(a) it would, but for this subsection, enable or require that person to occupy the caravan; or
(b) it includes terms implied by virtue of paragraph 5 of Part 1 of the Schedule.
(8) In relation to a residential agreement -
(a) any reference in this Part to the owner includes a reference to any person who is bound by and entitled to the benefit of the agreement by virtue of subsection (1); and
(b) subject to subsection (7), any reference in this Part to the occupier includes a reference to any person who is entitled to the benefit of and bound by the agreement by virtue of any of subsections (2) to (6).’
“Question: Subject to other consequential amendment, the Committee is content with Clause 5 as amended, put and agreed to.”
Clause 6: Jurisdiction
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it would not support amendments which would transfer jurisdiction on disputes in the residential caravan sector to a body like the Residential Property Tribunal.
“Question: Subject to consequential amendment, the Committee is content with Clause 6 as drafted, put and agreed to.”
Part 2: Agreements for Occupiers on Seasonal Sites
Clause 7: Application of this Part
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it supported amendments which would ensure that seasonal site users staying on protected sites would enjoy the same protections as seasonal site users staying on seasonal sites.
“Question put and agreed to: that the Committee for Social Development has agreed an amendment to Clause 7, namely:
Clause 7, page 5, line 5, leave out from ‘under’ to end of line 7 and insert ‘ -
(a) under which a person is entitled to station a caravan on land forming part of a caravan site and occupy the caravan for a period exceeding 28 days; and
(b) which is not a residential agreement within the meaning of Part 1.’
Clause 7, page 5, leave out lines 10 to 15.”
“Question: Subject to consequential amendment, the Committee is content with Clause 7 as amended, put and agreed to.”
Clause 8: Particulars of agreements
Agreed: The Committee agreed that as with Clause 7, it supported amendments which would ensure that seasonal site users staying on protected sites would enjoy the same protections as seasonal site users staying on seasonal sites.
“Question put and agreed to: that the Committee for Social Development has agreed an amendment to Clause 8, namely:
Clause 8, page 5, line 19, leave out ‘seasonal’ and insert ‘caravan’
Clause 8, page 5, line 33, leave out ‘seasonal’ and insert ‘caravan’
Clause 8, page 6, line 1, leave out ‘seasonal’ and insert ‘caravan’ ”
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it would defer further consideration of Clause 8 pending additional information on proposed amendments relating to the requirement for seasonal site owners to consult with, and take account of, qualifying residents’ associations.
Part 3: Protection of Residential Occupiers from Eviction and Harassment
Clause 9: Application of this Part
“Question: Subject to consequential amendment, the Committee is content with Clause 9 as drafted, put and agreed to.”
Clause 10: Protection of occupiers against eviction and harassment
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it would support an amendment which would give district councils the power to investigate and prosecute complaints related to eviction and harassment in the residential caravan sector.
“Question put and agreed to: that the Committee for Social Development has agreed an amendment to Clause 10, namely:
Clause 10, page 7, line 43, at end insert -
‘(12) Proceedings for an offence under this section may be instituted by the district council in whose district the site is situated.’ ”
“Question: Subject to consequential amendment, the Committee is content with Clause 10 as amended, put and agreed to”.
Clause 11: Provision for suspension of eviction orders
“Question: Subject to consequential amendment, the Committee is content with Clause 11 as drafted, put and agreed to.”
Clause 12: Supplementary
“Question: Subject to consequential amendment, the Committee is content with Clause 12 as drafted, put and agreed to.”
Part 4: Meaning of “Caravan”
Clause 13: Meaning of “Caravan” in this Act
“Question: Subject to consequential amendment, the Committee is content with Clause 13 as drafted, put and agreed to.”
Clause 14: Definition of “Caravan” in Caravans Act
“Question: Subject to consequential amendment, the Committee is content with Clause 14 as drafted, put and agreed to.”
Part 5: Supplementary
Clause 15: Interpretation.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it would not support an amendment which would alter the definition of a protected site so as to exclude NIHE Travellers’ sites.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that as with Clauses 7 and 8, it supported amendments which would ensure that seasonal site users staying on protected sites would enjoy the same protections as seasonal site users staying on seasonal sites.
“Question put and agreed to: that the Committee for Social Development has agreed an amendment to Clause 15, namely:
Clause 15, page 10, line 26, leave out ‘protected site or a seasonal site’ and insert ‘caravan site’
Clause 15, page 10, line 32, leave out ‘seasonal site’ and insert ‘site in respect of which the relevant planning permission or site licence -
(a) is expressed to be granted for holiday use only; or
(b) is otherwise so expressed or subject to such conditions that there are times of the year when no caravan may be stationed on the land for human habitation;’
Clause 15, page 10, leave out line 36”
“Question: Subject to consequential amendment, the Committee is content with Clause 15 as amended, put and agreed to”.
Clause 16: Commencement
“Question: Subject to consequential amendment, the Committee is content with Clause 16 as drafted, put and agreed to.”
Mr Gallagher left the meeting at 10.58am.
Clause 17: Short Title
“Question: Subject to consequential amendment, the Committee is content with Clause 17 as drafted, put and agreed to.”
Part 1 of the Schedule
Mr Gallagher rejoined the meeting at 11.06am.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it did not support amendments which would: remove the limit on commission on caravan sales; require the commission to be based on market value rather actual price paid or require the commission level to be set out in residential agreements.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it supported a Departmental amendment which would clarify the policy intention of the Bill that commission levels on caravan sales be limited to 10%.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it supported a Departmental amendment which would ensure that Travellers using NIHE caravan sites would not be charged commission by the Housing Executive when they sold their caravans.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it would not support amendments which would alter the powers that caravan site owners have to evict undesirable tenants or withhold permission for a caravan sale.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it would not support an amendment to change the Retail Price Index measure which is to be used to determine pitch fees.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it would not support an amendment which would add explicit provisions to ensure that caravan owner occupiers were able to remove their caravan from a site at a reasonable cost.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it would not support an amendment proposed by the Housing Executive to exempt Travellers’ sites from the gifting provisions of the Bill.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to support an amendment which would allow residential caravan site owners (including the Housing Executive) to designate improvements to the amenities on a site as essential or emergency works. The Committee further agreed to support an amendment which would permit the site owner to apply to the court to relocate residents to another site while essential or emergency works were ongoing, where it is reasonable to do so.
“Question put and agreed to: that the Committee for Social Development has agreed amendments to Part 1 of the Schedule, namely:
Schedule 1, page 14, line 11, leave out ‘the rate of 10%’ and insert ‘a rate not exceeding 10% of the sale price’ ”
Schedule 1, page 14, line 15, at end insert -
“(11) In relation to a caravan on a travellers’ site (within the meaning given by section 5(3)(c)), this paragraph applies with the omission of -
(a) sub-paragraph (9); and
(b) in paragraph (10), the words “Except to the extent mentioned in sub-paragraph (9),”.’
Schedule 1, page 15, line 5, at end insert ‘or to any amenities on the site’
Schedule 1, page 14, line 30, leave out ‘the protected site’ insert ‘any protected site of the owner’ ”
“Question: Subject to consequential amendment, the Committee is content with Part1 of the Schedule of the Bill as amended, put and agreed to”.
Part 2 of the Schedule
“Question: Subject to consequential amendment, the Committee is content with Part 2 of the Schedule as drafted, put and agreed to.”
Part 3 of the Schedule
“Question: Subject to consequential amendment, the Committee is content with Part 3 of the Schedule as drafted, put and agreed to.”
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it would not support an amendment which would repeal the Unauthorised Encampments (Northern Ireland) Order 2005.
Mrs Bradley left the meeting at 11.09am.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it would defer further consideration of an amendment which would remove the need for the Housing Executive and district councils to apply for a license for a caravan site.
Mr McCann declared an interest as a Member of Belfast City Council at 11.15am.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it would not support an amendment which would remove the requirement under which Travellers staying on an NIHE site of over 400 square yards, are required to apply for site licences individually.
The Chairperson thanked the official.
The official left the meeting at 11.20am.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to continue its clause-by-clause scrutiny of the Caravans Bill at the next Committee meeting.
Proceedings were suspended at 11.21am
Ms Ní Chuilín left the meeting at 11.21am.
The meeting resumed at 11:27am.
6. Subordinate Legislation
6.1 Proposed Statutory Rule: The Housing Benefit (Miscellaneous Amendments) Regulations (Northern Ireland) 2010.
The following Departmental officials joined the meeting at 11.28am:
Ms Anne McCleary – Director of Social Security Policy & Legislation Division, DSD; and
Mr Michael Pollock – Social Security Policy & Legislation Division, DSD.
Ms Ní Chuilín rejoined the meeting at 11.31am.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it would defer consideration of the proposed statutory rule pending receipt of further information from the Department. The Committee directed the Clerk to write to the Department seeking clarity on how the transfer of the “baby element” from tax credits to Housing Benefit will affect claimants in Northern Ireland and whether the change is in effect a cut in benefit.
The officials remained at table to brief Members on the next agenda item.
Mrs Bradley rejoined the meeting at 11.46am.
6.2 SR 340/2010 The Social Security (Housing Costs) (Standard Interest Rate) (Amendment) Regulations (Northern Ireland) 2010.
The officials briefed Members on aspects of the Statutory Rule.
As a consensus could not be reached on the laid Rule, the Committee divided on the proposal that:
“The Committee for Social Development has considered Statutory Rule 2010 No.340: The Social Security (Housing Costs) (Standard Interest Rate) (Amendment) Regulations (Northern Ireland) 2010 and subject to the Examiner’s report has no objection to the Rule”
The Committee divided: Ayes 7; Noes 3; Abstentions 0.
AYES
Mr Simon Hamilton
Mr Sydney Anderson
Mrs Mary Bradley
Mr Jonathan Craig
Mr Alex Easton
Mr Tommy Gallagher
Ms Anna Lo
NOES
Mr Mickey Brady
Mr Fra McCann
Ms Carál Ní Chuilín
ABSTENTIONS
None
The motion was carried.
Question put and agreed:
“The Committee for Social Development has considered Statutory Rule: SR 2010 No. 340 : The Social Security (Housing Costs) (Standard Interest Rate) (Amendment) Regulations (Northern Ireland) 2010 and subject to the Examiner’s report has no objection to the Rule.”
Noted: The Committee noted significant and wide-ranging concerns in respect of this statutory rule and reiterated the need for regular updates on the impact of the rule on repossessions and progress in respect of the Department’s engagement with voluntary mortgage advice providers to limit avoidable repossessions by ensuring appropriate benefit uptake.
The Chairperson thanked the officials.
Officials left the meeting at 12.17pm.
6.3 SR 344/2010 The Social Fund (Cold Weather Payments) (General) (Amendment) Regulations (Northern Ireland) 2010.
Question put and agreed:
“The Committee for Social Development has considered Statutory Rule: SR 2010 No. 344 : The Social Fund (Cold Weather Payments) (General) (Amendment) Regulations (Northern Ireland) 2010 and subject to the Examiner’s report has no objection to the Rule.”
6.4 SR 345/2010 The Social Security (Miscellaneous Amendments No.6) Regulations (Northern Ireland) 2010.
Question put and agreed:
“The Committee for Social Development has considered Statutory Rule: SR 2010 No. 345 : The Social Security (Miscellaneous Amendments No.6) Regulations (Northern Ireland) 2010 and subject to the Examiner’s report has no objection to the Rule.”
6.5 SR 346/2010 The Social Security (Contribution Conditions for Jobseeker’s Allowance and Employment and Support Allowance) Regulations (Northern Ireland) 2010.
Question put and agreed:
“The Committee for Social Development has considered Statutory Rule: SR 2010 No. 346 : The Social Security (Contribution Conditions for Jobseeker’s Allowance and Employment and Support Allowance) Regulations (Northern Ireland) 2010 and subject to the Examiner’s report has no objection to the Rule.”
Noted: The Committee noted Members’ concerns in relation to claimants who may be eligible for income-related ESA and income-based JSA but who, because they have a working partner, are unable to claim these benefits.
Mr McCann left the meeting at 12.22pm.
6.6 SR 347/2010 The Employment and Support Allowance (Transitional Provisions and Housing Benefit) (Existing Awards) (Amendment) Regulations (Northern Ireland) 2010.
Question put and agreed:
“The Committee for Social Development has considered Statutory Rule: SR 2010 No. 347 : The Employment and Support Allowance (Transitional Provisions and Housing Benefit) (Existing Awards) (Amendment) Regulations (Northern Ireland) 2010 and subject to the Examiner’s report has no objection to the Rule.”
Mr McCann rejoined the meeting at 12.24pm.
6.7 Proposed Statutory Rule: The Provision of Services (Street Trading) Regulations (Northern Ireland) 2010
Mr Anderson declared an interest as a Member of Craigavon Borough Council at 12.25pm.
Mr Easton left the meeting at 12.26pm.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to defer consideration of the proposed rule pending a briefing from the Department on the impact of this rule on the control of street trading.
7. Licensing and Registration of Clubs (Amendment) Bill – Review of Clauses and Proposed Amendments
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it would not consider this agenda item.
8. Correspondence
Agreed: The Committee agreed that a representative of Assembly Research & Library Services should attend a Department for Social Development event which is described as an exploration of “…the future path for the voluntary and community sector in Northern Ireland” on Tuesday 26 October 2010 at the Spectrum Centre, Shankill Road Belfast.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to consider Departmental correspondence on the Support for Owner Occupiers in Redevelopment Areas consultation and correspondence from Edward Cooke (Building Projects, Chartered Buildings Surveyors) on contract work undertaken for NIHE at the next Committee meeting.
Agreed : The Committee agreed that the disposition of the remaining correspondence included in Members’ packs should be at the discretion of the Chairperson.
9. Forward Work Programme
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it was content with the Forward Work Programme as amended.
10. Any Other Business
Agreed: The Committee agreed that the Clerk should write to the Department to seek an update on the timeline for the mid-term review of the Neighbourhood Renewal Strategy with a view to scheduling briefings on this subject when the legislative programme permits.
11. Date, time and place of next meeting
The next meeting will take place on Thursday, 4 November 2010 at 9.30am, in Room 29, Parliament Buildings.
The Chairperson adjourned the meeting at 12.30pm.
Mr Simon Hamilton MLA
Chairperson, Committee for Social Development
4 November 2010
14 October 10 / Menu
