COMMITTEE FOR JUSTICE
MINUTES OF PROCEEDINGS
THURSDAY, 13 JANUARY 2011
ROOM 29, PARLIAMENT BUILDINGS
Present:
Lord Morrow MLA (Chairman)
Mr Raymond McCartney MLA (Deputy Chairman)
Lord Browne MLA
Mr Thomas Buchanan MLA
Sir Reg Empey MLA
Mr Paul Givan MLA
Mr Alban Maginness MLA
Mr Conall McDevitt MLA
Mr David McNarry MLA
Ms Carál Ní Chuilín MLA
Mr John O’Dowd MLA
In Attendance:
Mrs Christine Darrah (Assembly Clerk)
Mrs Roisin Donnelly (Assistant Assembly Clerk)
Mr Vincent Gribbin (Assistant Assembly Clerk)
Mr Joe Westland (Clerical Supervisor)
Mr Kevin Marks (Clerical Officer)
The meeting commenced at 2.02 p.m. in public session.
1. Apologies
There were no apologies.
2. Matters Arising
The Committee noted that an oral briefing session on the draft budget 2011- 15 and the Department of Justice savings plans and impact of the spending proposals had been scheduled for Thursday 20 January 2011 but that the relevant written information would not be available until shortly before the meeting.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that the briefing should be re-scheduled to Tuesday 25 January.
3. Committee Forward Work Programme
The Committee considered a draft forward work programme for the period up to and including the meeting on 3 February 2011, the main focus of which was the completion of the oral evidence sessions and clause by clause consideration of the Justice Bill. Additional meetings had been scheduled for Tuesday 18 January, Tuesday 25 January and Tuesday 1 February.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that the briefing by the Chief Inspector on the CJI Report on NI Prison Service Corporate Governance Arrangements should be moved to Tuesday 1 February 2011 to accommodate the re-schedule budget briefing.
Agreed: The Committee agreed the draft work programme as amended.
4. Briefing on proposals for a Statutory Rule to commence in Northern Ireland Section 2(1) (d) of the Corporate Manslaughter and Corporate Homicide Act 2007
Gareth Johnston, Head of Justice Strategy Division, David Mercer, Criminal Law Branch, Tony McDonnell, Head of Estates Management, Northern Ireland Prison Service, and Hugh Mercer, Health and Safety Manager, Northern Ireland Prison Servicejoined the meeting at 2.15 p.m.
The officials briefed the Committee on the proposals for a Statutory Rule to commence in Northern Ireland Section 2(1) (d) of the Corporate Manslaughter and Corporate Homicide Act 2007 to bring into operation that part of the offence of corporate manslaughter that applies to duties of care owed to persons in custody or detention. A question and answer session followed during which issues such as the role of the PSNI in deaths in custody; the implications of the proposed legislation for NIPS senior managers and Governors; the role of the Prisoner Ombudsman in the process; and the compatibility of the Statutory Rule with EU legislation the readiness of the Prison Service for the law to be introduced were raised.
2.23 p.m. Mr McNarry joined the meeting.
During the question and answer session officials agreed to provide the Committee with further information.
The Chairman thanked the officials for the briefing and they left the meeting.
The Committee noted that it had referred the matter to the Committee for Health, Social Services and Public Safety for its views given the implications for the Department of Health.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that it would consider the proposals further once the Department of Justice had provided the further information and a response had been received by the Health Committee.
5. The Justice Bill – Oral evidence session by the NI Human Rights Commission
Professor Monica McWilliams, Chief Commissioner, Ciarán Ó Maoláin, Head of Legal Services, Policy and Research, and Ann Jemphrey, Policy Workerjoined the meeting at 3.10 p.m.
The Chief Commissioner and her Officials briefed the Committee on the clauses of the Justice Bill and answered questions from Members on issues such as a definition of sectarianism, the offender levy and fixed penalty notices.
3.40 p.m. Mr McNarry left the meeting.
The Chairman thanked the Chief Commissioner and her officials for the briefing.
The evidence session was recorded by Hansard.
Response by Department of Justice officials on the issues raised by the NI Human Rights Commission
Gareth Johnston, Head of Justice Strategy Division, Janice Smiley, Head of Criminal Policy Unit, Tom Haire, Justice Bill Manager and Chris Matthews, Head of Sentencing Delivery and European Unit joined the meeting at 3.45 p.m.
The Departmental officials responded to the issues raised by the NI Human Rights Commission on the Justice Bill.
3.49 p.m. Mr Givan joined the meeting.
The Chairman thanked the officials for the briefing and they left the table.
The evidence session was recorded by Hansard.
6. Justice Bill: Advice from the Examiner of Statutory Rules on the Delegated Powers Memorandum
The Committee considered advice received from Assembly Examiner of Statutory Rules on the delegated powers contained in the Justice Bill and in particular Clause 2 (4) and (5), Clause 82 (5), Clause 85 (2) and Clause 89 (2), and why some Court Rules are not subject to any Assembly procedure. The Committee also noted information provided on the background and reasons why rules made by the Magistrate’s Court Rules Committee and the County Court Rules Committee are not subject to Assembly procedures.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to write to the Minister of Justice outlining that it was minded to amend Clause 82 (5), 85 (2) and 89 (2) to make the powers contained in them subject to the draft affirmative procedure and seeking his views and commitments to do this. His views on possible changes to the position in relation to Court Rules should also be requested.
7. Clause by Clause consideration of the Justice Bill
Gareth Johnston, Janice Smiley, Tom Haire and Chris Mathews returned to the table at 4.06 p.m. to provide further information and clarification, if necessary on Clauses 1 to 19 of the Justice Bill.
The Committee reviewed the evidence provided on clauses 1 to 19 of the Bill and sought further information and clarification from the departmental officials on clauses 2, 4, 7, 8, 11, 12, 13, 16 and 19.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to undertake formal consideration of clauses 1-19 at the meeting scheduled for 20 January 2011 and to continue its consideration of the Bill at the meeting scheduled for 18 January 2011.
4.53 p.m. Mr Givan left the meeting.
The Chairman thanked the officials for the briefing as they left the table.
The evidence session was recorded by Hansard.
8. Consideration of proposals to increase Jurisdictional Limits in the County Courts
The Committee considered further information provided by the Department of Justice on proposals to increase the jurisdictional limits of County Courts and a number of issues were discussed.
Agreed: The Committee agreed that an oral briefing by departmental officials on the proposals was required.
9. Transfer of Functions (Tribunal Reform) Order (NI) 2010
The Committee considered proposals from the Office of the First Minister and deputy First Minister to make a Transfer of Functions Order which would allow the Department of Justice to assume statutory responsibility for the administration of a range of tribunals.
Sir Reg Empey declared an interest as having been involved in the discussions relation to this matter, when he was Minister for Employment and Learning.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to write to the Department of Justice seeking confirmation that satisfactory agreement has been reached with relevant Departments on the functions and, in particular the resources – budgets and staff – to be transferred.
10. Chairman’s Business
The Chairman informed the Committee that 4 members of the Committee, including himself and the Deputy Chairman, would be participating in the annual Criminal Justice Inspectorate Stakeholder Conference which was due to take place on Wednesday 19 January 2011.A copy of the programme had been circulated and any other Member who wished to attend was advised to inform the clerk who would make the necessary arrangements.
11. Correspondence
(i) The Committee noted correspondence from the Minister for Justice regarding the Terrorist Asset-Freezing Bill 2010.
(ii) The Committee considered correspondence from the Department for Justice responding to issues raised by Dungannon and South Tyrone Borough Council in relation to the illegal dumping of laundered diesel waste.
Lord Morrow declared his interest as a Member of Dungannon and South Tyrone Borough Council.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to write to the Minister of Justice seeking details of the legislation that places a statutory duty on Councils for the disposal of waste from fuel laundering.
(iii) The Committee considered correspondence from the Committee for the Environment regarding the Planning Bill.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to forward the correspondence to the Department of Justice for a response on any justice related issues.
(iv) The Committee noted further information provided by the Acting Director of the Public Prosecution Service in relation to work being undertaken in connection with the Saville Inquiry.
(v) The Committee considered correspondence from a Mr Godfrey regarding the Police Disability Pensions Appeals Procedure.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to forward the correspondence to the NI Policing Board to respond directly to Mr Godfrey regarding the issues he raised and request a copy of the response for information.
(vi) The Committee considered correspondence from the Committee for Finance and Personnel regarding the Damages (Asbestos-Related Conditions) Bill.
Agreed: The Committee agreed to forward the correspondence to the Department of Justice for a response on any justice related issues.
(vii) The Committee noted correspondence from the Department of Justice providing further information on the Alternatives to Prosecution clauses of the Justice Bill, the contents of which will be considered during the clause by clause consideration of the Bill.
12. Any Other Business
None.
13. Date and Time of next Meeting
The next meeting will be held on Tuesday 18 January at 3.00 p.m. in Room 29, Parliament Buildings.
5.15 p.m. The Chairman adjourned the meeting.
Lord Morrow of Clogher Valley MLA
Chairman, Committee for Justice
20 January 2011
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